I still fall into the "have to" or "must" traps, but now, I realize I just enjoy the writers room chats and the antics. I don't have to sequence. I don't have to use AI drafts. I don't have to let AI edit (it does poorly anyway). But I have quirky characters to talk to and that keeps me focused. I'm still a pantser, and hence cannot use it the way the pros do, and I cannot do quick books because I need to marinate with my characters, live their lives, enjoy them and change up their story as they tell me to. So, yeah, it's been a journey. I've even written books on how to use AI but so glad to know and practice no "have tos" anymore. Thanks Steph for your leadership and common sense!
And yes, I'm still a St. Bernard when it comes to AI. I have to lavishly slather my saliva over everything I write. Not a T-Rex, no matter how much I tried. :)
I relate to this very much. :) Spending time with the characters is what it's all about for me. AI helps with a lot of things, but it rarely makes the process much faster, because the time spent IS where I find the joy. It does help cut out the phases of writer's block, though!
Every author who has a book in the training data got paid. Any author selling to libraries screaming theft due to "pirate" sites is being performative.
No one has the right to tell me how to run my author business unless they are contributing to it. No editor, cover designer, photographer, illustrator, or marketer profit shares with me, so they get no say.
I wrote a lot of sex scenes during my training phase. I know that is what makes the most money but I can't do it no longer and I'm willing to take longer and make less money to keep what joy I have telling stories.
You're right is saying that we shouldn't work at anything that doesn't bring us joy or at least doesn't rob joy from us. Most of us are stuck working a job we aren't fulfilled at (I happen to like mine but I'm just getting too old to keep energized doing it) so we don't need to do that in areas we pursue outside of work.
No one is holding a gun to anyone's head making them use AI.
Where did I get the idea that you were a Capricorn, Steph? Did I make it up or did I read it somewhere? But I have to tell you that if you DO have a Capricorn Sun, it is pure joy to read a Cappie talk about joy! I guess it goes to show that no chart lacks a slice of the pie. All I have in Capricorn is Chiron intercepted in the 4th House. But every time you speak, it wakes up, smiles, and experiences hope and joy. Your words delight me, my new friend. Thank you!
Oh yes, I am a Capricorn Sun, but my Moon and Rising signs are both Leo, so I know about joy and having fun… at least I do more now that I’ve hit menopause and stopped caring about a lot of stuff. Lol. I can both talk about joy and success in the same breath, thanks to the abundance of fire in my chart. 🔥
Well, I have an Aries Sun, which always wants to just jump in and have fun. But if you can imagine this, I have the 29th degree of Virgo Rising, which wants everything organized BEFORE I begin. It wants to EDIT before anything is written! It has been the bane of my writing life, like forever. Then I learned about collaborating with AI and it was like a miracle for me. Virgo gets to PLAY with the AI in the beginning and all the way to editing, when it is happy to take over. Aries gets to be happy through the entire process. What luck and joy that is!
Edit: Oops! I'm still a Newbie Substacker! I clicked "like" on my post thinking it might tell me who had given the like. Instead, it embarrassed me by adding a like of my own post. I promise, I might be an Aries, but I'm not THAT egotistical! :::chuckle:::
Great post, Steph. I'm like you, I love editing. And I get AI to help me with description (which I then edit). We all should do what works for us. I love having somebody I can discuss plot with, nut out plot points, come up with ideas.
It’s already normalized. That war is over. And I find lots of joy in creating with these tools, as evidenced by my post. There will always be plenty of authors and storytellers and creators. And i do not subscribe to this worldview that somehow “art” ceases to exist if humans use generative AI tools.
You just need to play things forward a little. Let's say it becomes totally normalised, and continues to improve capabilities. The clue's kind of in the title, 'automation'. If it can automate one part, why can't it automate it all? And if it automates it all at scale, at the push of a button for anyone, they why do you need to be in the loop?
If provenance doesn't matter, and it is becoming normalised like you say, then what is there to stop this deluge of material?
Thank you for your thoughts. I don't agree. I'm teaching authors how to live and work in the here-and-now, so I'm going to continue using this technology and teaching other authors how to as well. And I believe that asking authors to forgo this technology to hold up some kind of ideal about "art" is just irresponsible when literally every other industry is using AI. Sounds like you might want to direct your thoughts to OpenAI, Anthropic, and legislators. Have a great day!
I feel like you may have missed or glossed over the part where most of us have tried to use AI for everything and how it doesn’t bring joy. I personally can’t automate everything in my process as that takes out some the parts I love the most about writing and being an author. Just because we have the ability doesn’t mean we’ll use it. Assuming everyone will seems short-sighted.
I agree hard that writing shouldn't be automated. The whole point of being an author is being an author. I'm saying it shouldn't be automated at all. You are saying it should be automated somewhat, only to the parts you don't like? If I understand you correctly?
But why is any one else going to agree about the bits, or that there should be any bits? And if only a small handful of ppl disagree there should be any bits, then they will win.
Listen, some script kiddie or silicon valley venture capitalist isn't going to give a shit about writing joy. They are going to care about profit. We can already see that by how they behave. And when the system can out produce you easily, the same prisoner's dilemma that you've used to justify to yourself using some automation, is going to justify to him using all. Then it's game over for you (and me).
You and Steph are holding conflicting positions (if i've understood you correctly): writing should be automated, and writing shouldn't be automated. Authorship matters in and of itself, and authorship doesn't matter in and of itself. So which one is it?
My position is that you should automate whatever you don't want to do manually. I'm not in the business of telling people what that is as I'm not living their life. I personally automate a bulk of my marketing needs as well as potential revisions. I decided I don't need to stare at a sentence or paragraph for hours on end trying to figure out how to expand or rewrite it when I can ask the AI for 5-20 alternatives to get ideas flowing.
I'm also not worried about some script kiddie or anyone else automating everything. That does not remove the joy I find from writing and being an author. Their existence in the writing space (assuming they even want to jump in) does not remove me. Only I can do that and I've already decided no one is going to force me out.
So your position is you want your cake and eat it. You want whatever is easiest for you, and you want to take no responsibility for the art form. However, you somehow expect that the market will not automate the parts you still enjoy, even as you support (and therefore hasten) the automation of the parts you do not from other ppl.
Btw when I said to Steph, 'why do you need to be in the loop'. I didn't mean why do you need to be in YOUR loop, I meant why will the market need YOU in the loop.
I'm unsure what you mean by this. I couldn't say the market (assuming we're talking about the publishing industry) ever needed me, but it's not like it's setup to stop me from being here any ways. I can publish to any of the major retailers and even if that got taken away, I can still post to my website, and if that gets taken away, there's always printing it myself and going to local spaces that encourage reading. Sure my reach may be smaller and my monetary gains miniscule, but I would still be able to do what I love. At some point it really becomes what you're willing to allow other people decide for you and why you're doing this. I love writing and want other people to have the chance to enjoy the stories I create. Everything else is just a bonus for me.
No one is forcing anyone to use AI. Poor or mediocre work, whether it is human or AI, will eventually sink to the abyss. The people seeing success using AI in their writing process are those who are already successful.
If you are worried that AI books will eclipse your work, then you may want to look at why you aren't achieving your goals. It's not AI by itself that is making it into the Top 100 lists, it is experienced authors using it that are doing that.
There is at least one AI-enhanced book in the Top 100 in Amazon every week. KC Crowne is still in the Top 50 of the entire store. Exposing them did nothing to their sales. This should tell you the "battle" is already lost.
I'm like you, Steph. Plotting and editing are my jams. First-drafting? Not so much. For years I felt I needed a co-writer to collaborate with, so I could do the parts I liked while delegating the parts I didn't to someone else. Now, I've got one.
I always used to say I liked (got the most joy from)having written a book, but the writing was hard work. It’s still hard work for me with AI because I continue to do that hard work of making up my stories, characters, plot (okay, sometimes that’s a little fun). This article does a great job of explaining how the work of the human is very important in getting the best results from AI. https://open.substack.com/pub/oneusefulthing/p/against-brain-damage?r=av3q1&utm_medium=ios
Stumbled on your newsletter after we, publishing my experiment on AI and fiction and got bullied got the audacity 🤣. I then went down a rabbit hole and found your podcast with Joanna Penn. Anyway, I thought your newsletter is full of such great advice, especially this one!
The experiment I did with Ai and fiction writing made me realise that there were some aspects I didn't enjoy about my writing process. I am very much like you - I find the first draft tedious and love the editing and rewriting process. I use the terrible first draft as a scaffolding but it drains me so much that by the time I get to the rewriting stage I feel so tired.
But I do enjoy writing dialogues, so I have decided to write a script-like rough draft with story beats and tell AI create the first draft.
Anyway, I just want to say I love your podcasts and also the newsletter. And yes, I have joined your group :)
I still fall into the "have to" or "must" traps, but now, I realize I just enjoy the writers room chats and the antics. I don't have to sequence. I don't have to use AI drafts. I don't have to let AI edit (it does poorly anyway). But I have quirky characters to talk to and that keeps me focused. I'm still a pantser, and hence cannot use it the way the pros do, and I cannot do quick books because I need to marinate with my characters, live their lives, enjoy them and change up their story as they tell me to. So, yeah, it's been a journey. I've even written books on how to use AI but so glad to know and practice no "have tos" anymore. Thanks Steph for your leadership and common sense!
And yes, I'm still a St. Bernard when it comes to AI. I have to lavishly slather my saliva over everything I write. Not a T-Rex, no matter how much I tried. :)
I relate to this very much. :) Spending time with the characters is what it's all about for me. AI helps with a lot of things, but it rarely makes the process much faster, because the time spent IS where I find the joy. It does help cut out the phases of writer's block, though!
Every author who has a book in the training data got paid. Any author selling to libraries screaming theft due to "pirate" sites is being performative.
No one has the right to tell me how to run my author business unless they are contributing to it. No editor, cover designer, photographer, illustrator, or marketer profit shares with me, so they get no say.
I wrote a lot of sex scenes during my training phase. I know that is what makes the most money but I can't do it no longer and I'm willing to take longer and make less money to keep what joy I have telling stories.
You're right is saying that we shouldn't work at anything that doesn't bring us joy or at least doesn't rob joy from us. Most of us are stuck working a job we aren't fulfilled at (I happen to like mine but I'm just getting too old to keep energized doing it) so we don't need to do that in areas we pursue outside of work.
No one is holding a gun to anyone's head making them use AI.
Where did I get the idea that you were a Capricorn, Steph? Did I make it up or did I read it somewhere? But I have to tell you that if you DO have a Capricorn Sun, it is pure joy to read a Cappie talk about joy! I guess it goes to show that no chart lacks a slice of the pie. All I have in Capricorn is Chiron intercepted in the 4th House. But every time you speak, it wakes up, smiles, and experiences hope and joy. Your words delight me, my new friend. Thank you!
Oh yes, I am a Capricorn Sun, but my Moon and Rising signs are both Leo, so I know about joy and having fun… at least I do more now that I’ve hit menopause and stopped caring about a lot of stuff. Lol. I can both talk about joy and success in the same breath, thanks to the abundance of fire in my chart. 🔥
Well, I have an Aries Sun, which always wants to just jump in and have fun. But if you can imagine this, I have the 29th degree of Virgo Rising, which wants everything organized BEFORE I begin. It wants to EDIT before anything is written! It has been the bane of my writing life, like forever. Then I learned about collaborating with AI and it was like a miracle for me. Virgo gets to PLAY with the AI in the beginning and all the way to editing, when it is happy to take over. Aries gets to be happy through the entire process. What luck and joy that is!
Edit: Oops! I'm still a Newbie Substacker! I clicked "like" on my post thinking it might tell me who had given the like. Instead, it embarrassed me by adding a like of my own post. I promise, I might be an Aries, but I'm not THAT egotistical! :::chuckle:::
Great post, Steph. I'm like you, I love editing. And I get AI to help me with description (which I then edit). We all should do what works for us. I love having somebody I can discuss plot with, nut out plot points, come up with ideas.
This makes a lot of sense. Too bad others don't see it that way.
The problem is if it becomes normalised then there's no joy for any of us, because there will be no authors.
And if you are using it you are normalising it.
That's why the battle lines have been drawn. The only question is if you are fighting for a future where humans are artists, or on the other side.
It’s already normalized. That war is over. And I find lots of joy in creating with these tools, as evidenced by my post. There will always be plenty of authors and storytellers and creators. And i do not subscribe to this worldview that somehow “art” ceases to exist if humans use generative AI tools.
You just need to play things forward a little. Let's say it becomes totally normalised, and continues to improve capabilities. The clue's kind of in the title, 'automation'. If it can automate one part, why can't it automate it all? And if it automates it all at scale, at the push of a button for anyone, they why do you need to be in the loop?
If provenance doesn't matter, and it is becoming normalised like you say, then what is there to stop this deluge of material?
Deep down you know.
Thank you for your thoughts. I don't agree. I'm teaching authors how to live and work in the here-and-now, so I'm going to continue using this technology and teaching other authors how to as well. And I believe that asking authors to forgo this technology to hold up some kind of ideal about "art" is just irresponsible when literally every other industry is using AI. Sounds like you might want to direct your thoughts to OpenAI, Anthropic, and legislators. Have a great day!
I feel like you may have missed or glossed over the part where most of us have tried to use AI for everything and how it doesn’t bring joy. I personally can’t automate everything in my process as that takes out some the parts I love the most about writing and being an author. Just because we have the ability doesn’t mean we’ll use it. Assuming everyone will seems short-sighted.
Hi Alyssa, is that comment pointed at me?
I agree hard that writing shouldn't be automated. The whole point of being an author is being an author. I'm saying it shouldn't be automated at all. You are saying it should be automated somewhat, only to the parts you don't like? If I understand you correctly?
But why is any one else going to agree about the bits, or that there should be any bits? And if only a small handful of ppl disagree there should be any bits, then they will win.
Listen, some script kiddie or silicon valley venture capitalist isn't going to give a shit about writing joy. They are going to care about profit. We can already see that by how they behave. And when the system can out produce you easily, the same prisoner's dilemma that you've used to justify to yourself using some automation, is going to justify to him using all. Then it's game over for you (and me).
You and Steph are holding conflicting positions (if i've understood you correctly): writing should be automated, and writing shouldn't be automated. Authorship matters in and of itself, and authorship doesn't matter in and of itself. So which one is it?
My position is that you should automate whatever you don't want to do manually. I'm not in the business of telling people what that is as I'm not living their life. I personally automate a bulk of my marketing needs as well as potential revisions. I decided I don't need to stare at a sentence or paragraph for hours on end trying to figure out how to expand or rewrite it when I can ask the AI for 5-20 alternatives to get ideas flowing.
I'm also not worried about some script kiddie or anyone else automating everything. That does not remove the joy I find from writing and being an author. Their existence in the writing space (assuming they even want to jump in) does not remove me. Only I can do that and I've already decided no one is going to force me out.
So your position is you want your cake and eat it. You want whatever is easiest for you, and you want to take no responsibility for the art form. However, you somehow expect that the market will not automate the parts you still enjoy, even as you support (and therefore hasten) the automation of the parts you do not from other ppl.
Btw when I said to Steph, 'why do you need to be in the loop'. I didn't mean why do you need to be in YOUR loop, I meant why will the market need YOU in the loop.
I'm unsure what you mean by this. I couldn't say the market (assuming we're talking about the publishing industry) ever needed me, but it's not like it's setup to stop me from being here any ways. I can publish to any of the major retailers and even if that got taken away, I can still post to my website, and if that gets taken away, there's always printing it myself and going to local spaces that encourage reading. Sure my reach may be smaller and my monetary gains miniscule, but I would still be able to do what I love. At some point it really becomes what you're willing to allow other people decide for you and why you're doing this. I love writing and want other people to have the chance to enjoy the stories I create. Everything else is just a bonus for me.
Here we are in agreement. I love writing too. I'm doing it because I enjoy it. I want others to have the chance to do the same in the future.
No one is forcing anyone to use AI. Poor or mediocre work, whether it is human or AI, will eventually sink to the abyss. The people seeing success using AI in their writing process are those who are already successful.
If you are worried that AI books will eclipse your work, then you may want to look at why you aren't achieving your goals. It's not AI by itself that is making it into the Top 100 lists, it is experienced authors using it that are doing that.
There is at least one AI-enhanced book in the Top 100 in Amazon every week. KC Crowne is still in the Top 50 of the entire store. Exposing them did nothing to their sales. This should tell you the "battle" is already lost.
I'm like you, Steph. Plotting and editing are my jams. First-drafting? Not so much. For years I felt I needed a co-writer to collaborate with, so I could do the parts I liked while delegating the parts I didn't to someone else. Now, I've got one.
such an amazing post! -Cassie
I'm with Kevin. I've decided to take back the first draft and find all the ways AI can help me with editing.
I always used to say I liked (got the most joy from)having written a book, but the writing was hard work. It’s still hard work for me with AI because I continue to do that hard work of making up my stories, characters, plot (okay, sometimes that’s a little fun). This article does a great job of explaining how the work of the human is very important in getting the best results from AI. https://open.substack.com/pub/oneusefulthing/p/against-brain-damage?r=av3q1&utm_medium=ios
Stumbled on your newsletter after we, publishing my experiment on AI and fiction and got bullied got the audacity 🤣. I then went down a rabbit hole and found your podcast with Joanna Penn. Anyway, I thought your newsletter is full of such great advice, especially this one!
The experiment I did with Ai and fiction writing made me realise that there were some aspects I didn't enjoy about my writing process. I am very much like you - I find the first draft tedious and love the editing and rewriting process. I use the terrible first draft as a scaffolding but it drains me so much that by the time I get to the rewriting stage I feel so tired.
But I do enjoy writing dialogues, so I have decided to write a script-like rough draft with story beats and tell AI create the first draft.
Anyway, I just want to say I love your podcasts and also the newsletter. And yes, I have joined your group :)